Religion scares me

[Elitist Indie Hipster]

Alright, so i am in kind of a predicament. I was brought in a household that never talked about religion, never thought about religion, and for all i know, never knew about religion. Now i am currently dating a young cathlic girl . For over a year now, i would like to think its getting to be a serious relationship. But, the thing is , when i go to church with her (a total of 3 times) i am deeply disturbed by it.

Now I dont know if i believe in god or heaven or not. I have yet to be decided. But currently i think i am leaning more to the non-believer side. Anyway back to the church thing. It just deeply disturbs me that they are praying to a entity that they have no knowledge of it even existing. They praise it so much for all the good it has done in their lives. People devote their life to it. But when i went with her to midnight mass, and they were saying their prayers in unison, it occured to me that they sounded like they were mindless brainwashed drones. The toneless monotone words they speak, in unison. I would like to say it sounded like a cult, but that wouldnt be right because i think its much more than that . I dont know how to explain it. And then they go around to each person demanding money. Regardless of whether you can afford it or not. If you dont, i got the picture that you are going to hell. I dont know, its hard to explain what i mean about mindless drones. In a way its almost making me think differently of my girlfriend, because i see a different side of her. She says those mindless monotone words along with everyone else. Am i the only one that thinks like this? Should i be thinking like this? Should i be thinking of religion from a different angle that i am not seeing ?

[Belial]

Religion, in its purest form, is a beautiful and powerful thing. It gives a direction to billions of people who would be directionless without it. Some studies have suggested that our brains are hardwired to accept some sort of religion, and I tend to believe that claim, as human beings are the only creatures on this planet that feels a need to understand its existence. Religion is a very simple and easy way to do just that.

Like your Girlfriend, I too was raised Catholic, though I haven't consider myself one for a long time. The chanting and ceremonies is just something Catholics do, but over the years I've come to see this as a good thing. Most the Catholics I know don't take religion too seriously, they go on Sunday, chant, sit down, standup, and sing for an hour, and go on with their lives. All the members of my family believe in evolution and the Vatican has said that the Bible and Darwin can co-exist. If you are thinking about getting serious with this girl, maybe you should investigate her faith a bit. Continue to attend masses with her and try to pay close attention to the readings and especially the homily (The part where the Priest just talks directly to the congregation about the readings.) I must warn you though; the Catholic Church loves its money. I've watched as the Arch-Diocese of Detroit screwed my local parish out of something like $5 million. When it gets down to it, the Church tends to dwell far too much on the fiscal and not the spiritual, but like I said, religion in its purest form is beautiful.

[amy]

agreed that I think you should try to understand it, like what they are saying between all the Jesus stuff, they are not saying "kill the jews kill the jews." If it's really bothering you, maybe have a non-confrontational conversation with her (if you are feeling up to it) about like her personal views on Catholicism, to see where she is coming from.

I know how you feel though, my best friend loves thirty five year old men and their movies like a religion and sometimes I think she is stupid for it. xD I am not interested at all.

Edited December 28, 2005 by amy

[Poophy]

Religion only makes sense if you don’t think about it too much, science only make sense if you think about it a lot, most people don’t like to think…

[HappyLittleBoozer]

Since I hate religion, I'm probably not the best person to give you info on it... but that's never stopped me before.

Religion is just cave man's ignorant fear of nature and death, dressed up for modern man.

[Elitist Indie Hipster]

see, Set, thats what i have always believed too. But i think if i want to make somthing of this relationship, i should at least try and understand it.

[Belial]

Religion only makes sense if you don’t think about it too much, science only make sense if you think about it a lot, most people don’t like to think…

Science only makes sense if you don't think about it too much too. I mean, to say you believe in the Big Bang takes just as much faith as saying you believe in a Creation Myth. You weren't there to see it and in both cases they involve something appearing out of nothingness. Plus science loves to contradict itself almost as often as Religion. Have you ever looked at the way physics works in quantum mechanics as oppose to how physics operate in general relativity. It’s like night and day, but both theories are considered equally valid.

Comments like yours and Sets are just as ignorant as the people pushing for Intelligent Design in classrooms. You are blindly dismissing the opposing side's arguments in both cases.

[Poophy]

Well….

ummmmm

*puts head down, shrugs shoulders, slowly walks away*… :sad:

[Elitist Indie Hipster]

to make it clear, it wasnt the whole idea that bothers me. Its the mindless chanting and the shuffling up in a line for communion to accept the body of Christ. it just creeped me out

The idea of god i understand

[Belial]

to make it clear, it wasnt the whole idea that bothers me. Its the mindless chanting and the shuffling up in a line for communion to accept the body of Christ. it just creeped me out

The idea of god i understand

You should be thankful of Vatican II otherwise you wouldn't understand any of the mindless chanting or readings or any of it for that matter, since it would all still be in Latin.

[Poophy]

Theres a reason that we have protestants, people thought catholics did strange things

[Anime Gee]

I find religion to be quite fascinating. It's mindblowing when you think about it. How a belief can totally shape a person & society is truly fucking amazing. It's really powerful. I spend hours reading about religion & it's involvement in society. Like stuff about the Crusades, Why the Irish catholics & protestants would always terrorize each other, why Latin American indians did human sacrifices, why other religious extremists say that killing your fellow man is the way to God, why the Nazis went after Jews, Jehovah's Witnesses, Gypsies, & whatnot, while claiming that God was on their side & at the same time, the Vatican did nothing about it & many priests supported the holocaust. It's truly fucking amazing! ('o' )!!

But yeah. You need to be more open to your girl & tell her that you're not comfortable going to church. At the same time, you shouldn't ban her from going to church if she likes going. You shouldn't push your beliefs on her like she shouldn't push her beliefs on to you. Yes young man! Being a little more tolerant can take you a long way! ( ^o^) <3

[darkon]

I've kind of given up on following my own religion. If someone wants to follow a religion I'm fine with it, hell, I'm fine getting married in a Church or whatever. It's not something important to me at all. Theology interests me, as well as religion's influence on western civilization, but I just can't drag myself to following a religion.

Let me add. I've been in Catholic schools all my life and I live in the major city of Catholicism in North America, and I can say that there are many good things which come out of Catholicism. We have so many people in Baltimore willing to sacrifice time to help those in need. We also have a good amount of people against the death penalty (Unfortunately, our state has too many people in the rural counties to get rid of it). Of course, there is also a small (And I emphasize small) group of people who are very hardcore Catholics. Those might be the worst of all religious people.

[Elitist Indie Hipster]

Oh, i dont push my beliefs on her, in fact i tell her to go to church if she feels like. On special occaisions i will go with her and go through the motions. For example midnight mass on christmas, and another time when she found out her grandfather has bonemarrow cancer. I went and i prayed with her, but i felt like i shouldn't be there. And i told her that i dont feel confortable going to church. and she accepted. From my understanding we both understand each others view on it. But i havent talked with her on why i am uncomfortable.

[Anime Gee]

Oh, i dont push my beliefs on her, in fact i tell her to go to church if she feels like. On special occaisions i will go with her and go through the motions. For example midnight mass on christmas, and another time when she found out her grandfather has bonemarrow cancer. I went and i prayed with her, but i felt like i shouldn't be there. And i told her that i dont feel confortable going to church. and she accepted. From my understanding we both understand each others view on it. But i havent talked with her on why i am uncomfortable.

Well then young man, sound like everything's coming along fine. Yes. You might want to sit down with her & talk some more. It's best to keep things in the clear where everyone understands what's going on instead of keeping things vague & have many misunderstanings, you now? ( ^o^) <3

[margot]

If your girlfriend really loves you, she should be able to understand the fact that you don't feel comfortable with religious activity. Just talk to her and explain how you feel. (perhaps more tactfully than saying everyone seemed like a drone ect)

I'm one of those people who hates religion and I could never date a devote christian/catholic/whatever.

[Pamuya]

if you respect and love her enough you will accept her beliefs but that does in no way mean you have to believe them yourself.

[Belial]

It sounds like you've got it all handled for now Indie, I only worry about what happens if you decide to marry this girl and she or her parents insist the ceremony is held in a Catholic Church. You would have to convert in order to comply with their wishes. Or if you were to have children, would they then be raised Catholic? It would be very difficult to get children to go to church when daddy can stay home and watch TV. I’m sure you will be able to handle these sorts of situations, but a better understanding of the religion will definitely help you along the way.

[Galkar]

Plus science loves to contradict itself almost as often as Religion. Have you ever looked at the way physics works in quantum mechanics as oppose to how physics operate in general relativity. It’s like night and day, but both theories are considered equally valid.

I don't think this is a very good analogy. True, they both contradict themselves all the time, but when religion does it, they tend to sort of gloss over it, whereas when science does it, they try to make sense of it. In the case of relativity versus quandtum mechanics, scientists have been trying for years to figure out how they can work together.

[HappyLittleBoozer]

Comments like yours and Sets are just as ignorant as the people pushing for Intelligent Design in classrooms. You are blindly dismissing the opposing side's arguments in both cases.

I should strangle you to death with my mind for fucking second guessing me but I'll just say this instead; Since I first told my preacher that I was never going to church again when I was ten years old, I've heard every arguement that could be made in favor of religion and I used my better than average knowledge of the subject, in combination with wit and guile to destroy every one of those arguements. I no longer feel it necessary to completely explain my entire arguement against religion, so I'll just state a proven anthropological fact...

Religion is just cave man's ignorant fear of nature and death, dressed up for modern man.

And to say that believing in the big bang is like believing in God is fucking stupid and you should be put into fucking prison for saying shit like that. It's a scientific fact that effects like a big bang occur in dying galaxies all the fucking time. That's what makes it a motherfucking theory and not some speculative bullshit like ID or creationism. I'd love to see you tell Stephen Hawking what you just fucking said and watch as he mentally rapes the shit out of you.

From now on, shut the fuck up on matters of religion or science, because it's obvious you know fucking nothing.

[Belial]

It's a scientific fact that effects like a big bang occur in dying galaxies all the fucking time.

Congrats, you win the "Most Ridiculous Statement I've Heard All Day Award"!!! Yay!!! Seriously Set, show me one shred of evidence that effects like The Big Bang happen all the time and I'll apologize, but I'm pretty sure that matter just doesn't spring out of nothingness all the time.

I'd love to see you tell Stephen Hawking what you just fucking said and watch as he mentally rapes the shit out of you.

I might be wrong, but I am pretty sure that Hawking is religious and I know for a fact Einstein was. These scientists know that science and religion can co-exist. In fact, Einstein said it best, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

[darkon]

Hawking's "Universe in a Nutshell" has plenty mentions of his belief in a higheer power creating the base of matter from which the Big Bang came about.

He's very, well, he's a waffler. He doesn't really know what he believes though.

[HappyLittleBoozer]

Congrats, you win the "Most Ridiculous Statement I've Heard All Day Award"!!! Yay!!! Seriously Set, show me one shred of evidence that effects like The Big Bang happen all the time and I'll apologize, but I'm pretty sure that matter just doesn't spring out of nothingness all the time.

I'm not going to show you, as I'm not even sure where to begin looking for it but for years scientists have come to know that at the center of every galaxy is a giant black hole surrounded by a bright mass of energy that is slowly being drawn into it. Eventually, after aeons, the last of the matter in the galaxy will be enveloped in the event horizon. That much energy condensed like that with nowhere to go can only do one thing... Explode. Thus, a Big Bang. That's one of the more recent additions applied to the theory, that our universe used to be a previous universe or at least a sea of lifeless energy that was enveloped by a giant black hole and then exploded into our current universe.

I might be wrong, but I am pretty sure that Hawking is religious and I know for a fact Einstein was. These scientists know that science and religion can co-exist. In fact, Einstein said it best, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

How could you misinterpret Einstein like that. All he's saying is that without religion, science has no reason to evolve as it has nothing to disprove and without science, religion will run amok. Einstein and Hawking aren't christians or even religious, they are Deists. They believe in a higher power but it's not necessarily a God or even a sentient being. Hell, even I believe in a kinetic energy, force, or power found in all matter, living and non living but that's a rational and intelligent concept, unlike the idea of an omnipotent, invisible man in the clouds that controls everything. That's just fucking stupid.

[uniform_motion]

I might be wrong, but I am pretty sure that Hawking is religious

Are you kidding me? xD

[Ceraziefish]

For most of High School I've gone to church every week. I've been going less lately but that's not because I don't like church but rather that I'm stressing out about applying for college and graduating and other such nonsense.

I've explained my religion (Unitarian Universalism) a few times but I don't think since the crash. Anyway, here goes.

UUism is basically about finding your own spirituality and set of beliefs. The church exists for a support group and a group of people to help you find what you want to believe. There is no dogma in UUism (except for that bit, I suppose).

It's loosely based in Christianity (as in, the founders of the religion went to either Universalist or Unitarian churches). The Universalists believed that a truly benevolent God would not send anyone to hell but that that was no reason to not be a good person. The Unitarians believed in the divinity of God only, not Jesus or that Holy Ghost crap. When the two groups combined they sort of lost the whole Christian said.

That being said, Church is pretty cool for me. A lot of my friends go there, I've gone there not on Sundays to do homework or just hang out, I took a sex ed class there (Holy crap!) which was basically people talking about how far they've gotten with various people and then inflating condoms into giant air filled clubs and beating each other with them (lubed clubs = <3). I had my first kiss at a church sponsored con.

Basically, it's not religious at all, which is fine by me.

So, in that sense, I think that church is a good thing. I'm a deist, I guess? I don't let it get to me too much.

I've been to a Catholic Church once in my life. I guess it was some sort of Evening Mass (this was a long time ago, and I don't really know anything about the Church anyway). Mostly what happened was we sang some songs, the dude talked a bunch, and then you were supposed to look around and shake hands with everyone and say "God be with you."

Kinda creepy, a little uncomfortable since I really had no idea what was going on... I wouldn't want to go to Church there. But I have been involved in 'droney' sort of activities. It's really not that creepy if you know what's going on.