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March 8, 2006

WASHINGTON – The U.S. House of Representatives passed a bill today that includes an embedded provision that revises and strengthens 2257 record-keeping law and makes it an even more formidable task for adult website operators to remain in compliance.

HR 4472, considered an “omniscient” bill, targets sex offenders and street gangs, among many other things. But buried within a lengthy index of terms is Title 6, which builds on a bill introduced in September by Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind. strengthening the recently amended U.S.C. 18 § 2257 requirements by adding requirements for record keepers and authorizing civil and criminal asset forfeiture in child exploitation and obscenity cases.

Industry attorney Jeff Douglas told XBiz that the bill is a substantial reenactment of 2257, and in its current form would redefine the term “producer” to include what is now categorized as “secondary producer,” effectively undoing the 10th Circuit’s 1998 decision in Sundance Associates vs. Reno. The Sundance opinion effectively determined the deliniation between producers and secondary producers and how those two parties are required to maintain records on content talent.

The bill was passed under a suspension of House rules, so no debate or discussions were allowed, Douglas said, further signaling a possible agenda on the part of lawmakers to rush it through to the Oval Office as quickly as possible.

“According to a House Republican, they have gotten a guarantee that the Senate also will take it up in an expedited fashion, and this suggests they don’t intend to hold any hearings,” Douglas said, adding that there has never been a congressional hearing on 2257 law since it was enacted in 1988.

“Whatever benefit they get from overturning Sundance, they are creating many new constitutional problems for themselves by these extraordinarily expansive sets of definitions,” Douglas said. “Through our lobbyist, we will continue to try speaking on behalf of the FSC to encourage them [lawmakers] to learn something about what they are legislating, since they have operated entirely in ignorance since they enacted 2257 in the first place.”

Additionally, the terms of the bill cover acts of simulated sex – which current 2257 law does not – as well as the current definition of actual sex, which means that it would cover most R-rated films and a substantial fraction of PG-rated films.

Tom Hymes, communications director for the Free Speech Coalition, called the House's approval of the bill “infuriating,” and said that while it builds a strong case for going after child pornographers, in no way does its language make a connection to the adult industry.

“There are things in there that are really, really bad,” Hymes told XBiz. “It takes 2257 from bad to worse.”

The Motion Picture Association of America and various other screen guilds have not yet responded to the House's passing of the bill.

“One would think that if Hollywood has to comply with the burdens of 2257, then the economic impact will substantially outstrip the substantial impact it will have on adult businesses,” Douglas said. “If they don’t get aggressively involved, they will be doing a severe disservice to their membership and to the entire Hollywood community.”

The bill is now being fast-tracked through the Senate and if signed by President Bush, it could potentially become law by September.

Douglas said that if it makes it that far, the FSC will either be forced to file a new lawsuit against the Justice Department or amend the current lawsuit to encompass this new piece of legislation. However, it does not affect the current status of the appeal of the preliminary injunction because the new law will only affect content created on or after the effective date it is passed.

Hymes added that he fully expects 4472 to become law. “And when it does, we will have to challenge it,” he said.

Only a few days later.

by Druid @ 16 Mar 2006 05:36 pm

Ok to clearify on whats going on..

Its not entirely Bush's fault.. But the real problem is the US LAW 2257.. When the law was in motion HentaiKey had to change its policy, which all webmasters under there network have to comply by the poilicy and with the US Law 2257.. Which you can look here http://xbiz.com/news_piece.php?id=13811

But anyways All webmaster including myself have to get rid of lolicon or underage images off of our sites.. If we don't comply with this policy, we will be removed off of Hkey site and will no longer be in there network.. It's really a no win situation for us webmasters that are with HKey or any other network that might be doing the same thing..

This means nobody in hentai can even look to be under 18.

A few days later this was posted on the now offline Hentai palm site.

Thanks to his anal government we are forced to take down our famous Hentai Palm Forums along with a short downtime of Hentai Palm until a sweeper team has cleared out the oh so un-Christian pictures that hurt the poor little fragile minds of the oh so *cough* faithful people (not referring to Christians in general here just to those stupid enough to visit adult websites and then complain about it afterwards). But that is not all as some of the content here apparently might ENDANGER children or corrupts their poor innocent minds. We are talking about the modern child here, who most likely had sex with the opposite or same sex long before he/she is legal to watch PORN. Imagine that, PORN! Killer of the sane mind. Who cares about the never ending violence on the American Television. They censor breasts and the word Fuck but they show to everyone how a person’s brain gets shot out or how people eat the most disgusting things for money. Hurrah for the current American society.

I might add that Childeren aren't even suppose to be on a website like this as these are meant for 18+.

If you wish to read more about this matter I advise you to visit http://www.numbus.com and read the latest article(s) there about this matter, this will no doubt clear up even more about this current situation.

To this point Hentai Palm, Hentai Palm Forums and several movies from Movie Palm are either removed or taken down till futher notice. Again I advice to check either the Hentai Group Portal site or Numbus.com for futher information. All the other Hentai Group Websites are still online and might be visted at any time.

- Numbus

Webmaster of Hentai Palm

Founder of Hentai Group

I'm not sure if he means they had to take it offline for now, or it was forced offline by government.

Now I'm no loli fan but I can't see anything good coming out of this.

P.S. Remember back a few months ago when I said that it won't be long before everyone has to prove who they are before viewing a site with adult stuff on it? Well here we are, one step closer.

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If the government embraced porn, or pot, the amount of money that could be made in tax revenue would be absolutely astounding. But apparently the moral fabric of the nation, and the government being parents for those who like having babies but not rasining them is more important than... I don't know... helping the poor, helping educate people, hell I'm sure a lot of the anti-porn brigade would change their mind when they found out massive porn taxes meant that they could actually pay LESS in taxes as well as MORE money going to the military.

But apparently nudity is a sin. I can't wait until they attack art museums. Come on, you know it's going to happen folks.

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Now I'm no loli fan but I can't see anything good coming out of this.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Porn being illegal is very silly. There's so many problems in the world, and the government chooses to crack down on pictures of naked anime girls.

They must have something better to do, really. Otherwise I don't see why we should be paying them.

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Took the words right out of my mouth.

Porn being illegal is very silly. There's so many problems in the world, and the government chooses to crack down on pictures of naked anime girls.

They must have something better to do, really. Otherwise I don't see why we should be paying them.

This is politics. They are doing something stupid so that stupid people will support them. Since most people are stupid about some things, getting stupid people is the easiest way to get elected

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This is politics. They are doing something stupid so that stupid people will support them. Since most people are stupid about some things, getting stupid people is the easiest way to get elected

Not to be contrary... But didn't you just get mad at me in another thread for saying the same thing more bluntly?

Your above example is why I say "Fuck this country."

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Thank God they're finally doing something about that pseudo-pedophilia bullshit. I know I'm definitely in the minority at this board regarding this subject, but lolicon just makes me fucking sick. You can argue about artistic value if you want, I don't care. Now if they could only do something about furries. If only.

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Thank God they're finally doing something about that pseudo-pedophilia bullshit. I know I'm definitely in the minority at this board regarding this subject, but lolicon just makes me fucking sick. You can argue about artistic value if you want, I don't care. Now if they could only do something about furries. If only.

Don't look at it.

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Don't look at it.

Sure, and it will go away. That's how all problems are solved, right? Well, I hate to burst your bubble, but this is one of the few times the government has done something right. I don't mean right as in convenient, I mean right as in morally justifiable. It just goes to show you that even a broken clock is right twice a day.

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Thank God they're finally doing something about that pseudo-pedophilia bullshit. I know I'm definitely in the minority at this board regarding this subject, but lolicon just makes me fucking sick. You can argue about artistic value if you want, I don't care. Now if they could only do something about furries. If only.

1. You don't have to look at it.

2. It's not only loli that they're going after.

3. This means that everybody in hentai and even some anime is going to have to look to be in their 30s or risk getting fucked. (Yes I know how that sounded, talking about hentai and all.. lol)

4. Mess with furries and fucking die! :angry:

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I often wonder how Alfred Kinsey would react to these types of things.

While many types of porn aren't very moral, YOU CAN'T BAN PERVERSIONS...

Try, go ahead, try... we'll see if those people don't find another way... you know?

Also, I don't want the government telling me what is perverted, what's next, HOMOSEXUALS?

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lolicon = Child porn

I for one, despise it.

There is a huge difference between ink and pencil and human beings. And, also, this isn't specifically targetting lolicon. It's targetting lolicon AND anything that might be lolicon. It doesn't have to state it is lolcion to be considered wrong by moral enforcers. I could say a granny had an aging problem and she is really 12, keep in mind this is all drawn, and probably get the site hosting it in trouble.

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1. You don't have to look at it.

I shouldn't have to, and neither should anyone else.

2. It's not only loli that they're going after.

Good. Maybe they'll sweep up guro, vore, and all of that other sickening shit.

3. This means that everybody in hentai and even some anime is going to have to look to be in their 30s or risk getting fucked. (Yes I know how that sounded, talking about hentai and all.. lol)

It beats child porn. It doesn't matter if it's drawn, photographed or rendered. Adults fucking children and children fucking children is morally wrong. I'm not even involving the legal side of it, I'm talking about the same wrong which encompasses rape, murder, and Metallica with Bob Rock.

4. Mess with furries and fucking die! :angry:

I'd like to see them fucking try.

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Not to be contrary... But didn't you just get mad at me in another thread for saying the same thing more bluntly?

Your above example is why I say "Fuck this country."

No. I got mad at you for saying "fuck this country." I say "our gov't has fucked up." The difference is that you're basically saying you hate our entire country, AND WISH US ILL. I'm saying this is wrong., not I hope every member of the Senate dies (McCain, and maybe barack should live. Along with ted kennedy and Kery so we have people to make fun of)

I shouldn't have to, and neither should anyone else.

Good. Maybe they'll sweep up guro, vore, and all of that other sickening shit.

NOBODY IS BEING FORCED TO LOOK AT IT. you are the only one here arguing that anyone should be forced to do anything. We're saying that people should be free, you're saying that they should be forced not to do something. it's your opinion s to what is sickening. I bet most people here agree that some of it is sickening, BUT we don't want to try to stop people from doing what they can't really be stopped from doing without killing them

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NOBODY IS BEING FORCED TO LOOK AT IT. you are the only one here arguing that anyone should be forced to do anything. We're saying that people should be free, you're saying that they should be forced not to do something. it's your opinion s to what is sickening. I bet most people here agree that some of it is sickening, BUT we don't want to try to stop people from doing what they can't really be stopped from doing without killing them

I think you're being a bit dramatic. I know people are still going to trade in child pornography, despite whatever laws we can throw at them. That doesn't mean we have to abandon laws meant to deter child porn. That's like saying we can't keep mass murderers from killing innocent people without killing them, so we'll just forget about trying to create and enforce the murder laws.

And don't even fucking try the argument that lolicon doesn't harm anyone. It harms the otherwise rational people who engage and trade in it, and it harms the potential child victims of those who can't distinguish between Sasami in the carrot patch and real life. It doesn't matter if it's drawn, photographed or rendered. Adults fucking children and children fucking children is morally wrong, regardless of the medium.

EDIT: I do like the idea of attatching the death penalty to child porn offenses though. Keep up the good work.

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you are the only one here arguing that anyone should be forced to do anything. We're saying that people should be free, you're saying that they should be forced not to do something. it's your opinion s to what is sickening. I bet most people here agree that some of it is sickening, BUT we don't want to try to stop people from doing what they can't really be stopped from doing without killing them

While I don't necessarily agree with Kruetz's opinion here, don't tell him he's wrong because he's the only person with that opinion. If that logic had merit, then the world would never change for the better. Ever.

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I think you're being a bit dramatic. I know people are still going to trade in child pornography, despite whatever laws we can throw at them. That doesn't mean we have to abandon laws meant to deter child porn. That's like saying we can't keep mass murderers from killing innocent people without killing them, so we'll just forget about trying to create and enforce the murder laws.

And don't even fucking try the argument that lolicon doesn't harm anyone. It harms the otherwise rational people who engage and trade in it, and it harms the potential child victims of those who can't distinguish between Sasami in the carrot patch and real life. It doesn't matter if it's drawn, photographed or rendered. Adults fucking children and children fucking children is morally wrong, regardless of the medium.

EDIT: I do like the idea of attatching the death penalty to child porn offenses though. Keep up the good work.

Then are you for banning violent videogames and music?

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I know how people feel about this, but there's something they have to understand. Child porn is banned not because it's sick, but because a child had to be abused for it to be made.

porn + child = crime

porn - child = not a crime

No matter how sick it really is, end of story. Well unless you like the idea of thought police.

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Nobody's saying child porn itself is right, right? If someone had to be abused to make it, then it is wrong and sick (It's called sexual abuse, which is illegal). All young children in porn had to be abused. Of course, then we also see 13 year old girls flashing over their webcams of their own will. So it's difficult to draw the line. I'm not sure where it should be drawn, but we should make sure that we don't allow photographs of the abused girls on websites. But we shouldn't attack the whole website for hosting anything, we should select individual pictures that we know are child porn (Most child porn rings in the world are known, at least on the internet. We might not know where they produce their stuff, but we know what work is theirs).

And I agree that any porn, of any sort, made from abuse (Not just child porn keep in mind) is wrong and sick. But, any drawing of any sort is not wrong. Nobody had to be abused for that. Plus, it is a slippery slope to take out porn of children since there are many books, paintings, and songs which feature pedophilia.

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